Have you been wondering about how to design your lifestyle overseas? Rigel (aka coinsurenz) rejoins me on the show to talk about jurisdictional arbitrage in Latin America. We talk about some of his recent moves and his experiences as a bitcoin sovereign individual: 

  • Voice vs Exit – what about ‘staying and fighting’? 
  • Recent residency acquisition in Paraguay
  • How the Latam residency market has shifted
  • Common mistakes that digital nomads make
  • Owning vs Renting homes and storage lockers
  • Designing your life


Prior episode:


Stephan Livera links:

Podcast Transcripts:      

Stephan Livera 00:03:03  

Rigel, welcome back to the show. 

CoinsureNZ 00:03:05 

How’s it going? Yeah, good to be back.  

Stephan Livera 00:03:09 

Well, lots of things going on in the world of jurisdictional arbitrage, let’s call it. I know that’s something you’re focused on. It’s something I like to talk about and think about also. And I think it’s becoming more and more clear now with how much things are crumbling in in the West that people thought these are such rich developed countries. Look how free we are. Most Australians and New Zealanders Canadians perhaps particularly learned why that was not so true in the last few years and I think an interesting topic that seems to have come up a bit recently as well is this concept of voice versus exit. Right. So, it’s sort of like this idea that some people who believe in this idea of. Staying and fighting right in the country versus exiting and I’m sure you have some thoughts on that. So, do you have any thoughts on voice versus exit as we are today as we stand today? 

CoinsureNZ 00:04:00  

Yeah, I mean, to me, I think the best quote about this is the Chinese proverb. Of I can’t remember the exact number but. It’s like the. 36 ways I think it’s called this is the book takes it comes from It’s like the More 36 ways to get out of trouble. The simplest is to leave and you know, I think that really sums it up to me in terms of course, you know. There are things in life. Which are worth standing and fighting for, you know. Putting your foot on the grounds, but you know, generally speaking, your best way to get up many fights of all things you know from my other professional experience and talking you know specifically about that, but also just in general as. A philosophical idea. You know, a lot of the battles that we get ourselves into in our daily lives are things that. You know, we would be better to just walk away from or At least consider that, and so, you know, I think in this particular example, yeah, I mean I think. What does your voice? Right, you know, I mean You obviously have the democratic system, hopefully, and whatever country that you’re in. That you can participate in. You know you can vote with your purchasing power or whatever other things, like if you own a business, you know that perhaps is an extension of your will or your influence there. You know about what decision you make there. But ultimately you know your decision are quite limited and in a world veteran today, I think the other thing to consider is just the way that social media and that Narrative is so difficult to kind of catch and control, it’s really. Kind of its, the horse is bolted from the staple, if you like, and it’s kind of out of control. So I mean I think. Like really, it makes a. Lot more sense to me to look at these things. Would you have other options? Why would you not simply go to those options that stay? And if you have a very limited set of options, maybe there are some people where when we’re talking about jurisdictional arbitrage, they can’t leave what they are, right? They may have. Some health issue. There may be some family reasons. There may. Whatever other things you know where this is not an option. But if you have. These options, you know, I think why would you? Endure that  the stuff that you are continually, as you were saying. It’s becoming more. And more of an insurance effort to deal with. Why don’t you go for these things? Why would you not go to places where you know where you are treated better where your. Options are greater where and you know usually. There are some, you know, some logistics. And some things to figure out to get to those places. Listen change. But it’s like any investment, right? You know, it requires a bit of pain at. The start, but if. You think about what this will transform into in 5-10 years. You know, I see. It’s exactly like money or anything else, right? It’s investing energy and time and building a base in another jurisdiction and go there and you know, that’s much better than trying to change what you currently have. So yeah, very much exit rather voice. 

Stephan Livera 00:06:38  

Yeah, right. And so, I think there’s a few different lines that can come up at this. Point. Sometimes people say You’re a worse. You should stay and fight, or you know, or the other line. Sometimes people say is America is the last bastion. It’s the last possible place. And if you don’t, if we don’t stand up and win here, it’s all over. And of course, now it’s different for you and I because we’re not Americans. But what would you say to that kind of argument that, you know, this is the one. Unique place that freedom has to flourish. 

CoinsureNZ 00:07:08  

Like America, of all places, it’s not a bad place to make that argument right. You know, if there’s anywhere in the world, or I think. We you could make that. Argument America is it. But again. You know it’s a. Case of what is your agency in there bill right. You know, I think. It is quite Limited like and but not to say it. I mean, I think they’re the survival strategy. You know, you can’t take that thing of, like sand and fight and, you know, push to Change things, but what are the real methodologies that people? Are pushing and I don’t think they’re very credible are the ones that I’ve heard. Right, you know. Obviously, this political, you know, like former. Party voting for. This candidate or whatever. And really, I think the problem is the system itself, rather than any participant in that they’re. Not really going to fix things the issue is the foundation that. Was built on. All you have things like, you know, let’s get a bunch of guns and. You know like. Build a common commune or something. Like that. And you know, I just think that’s not the strategy that I believe is an effective one have dancing time with, you know, strategic things. And things like that you know it. It’s I mean That’s a very appealing kind of emotional idea, but I. Mean why would put yourself in this situation when you can simply just. Grow out the door, go somewhere else. You don’t have to deal with this. You know, have to, you know, deal with the possibility of someone shooting at you. You’re being arrested or, you know, all sorts of other consequences. Well, you just not go somewhere where it’s simpler, you know? So, you know, I can understand if you’re particularly patriotic or whatever, but, you know, to my mind, in my personal opinion, you know, I think the idea of like, nation States and patriotism and that kind of stuff is a. Flawed idea. You know, for much of human history. These imaginary lines around territories did not exist. Then you know if you’ve been born. 100 years earlier or later, you could have been. On a different side of that line, you. Know it, it doesn’t. Really mean to anything, I think to. Me. What is more important, we think. About like what nations mean, it’s like a. Shared sense of collective identity or? People that share a culture, and I think the. World that we are progressing towards more and more as the world. Those things are not defined by national boundaries, right? I would rather be in a location which is not necessarily any. Geographical space, but it’s a shared location where people that think the same way that I do that share my values that are have the same interests. And to me that’s my that sounds kind of corny. That’s my nation, right, my country, my tribe or whatever. And you. Know so. I think identifying with you know. Let’s defend America New Zealand, you know, whatever. It maybe you know I think that’s. It’s an Antiquated in a very. Broad thing in the day and age that we live in today, you should be more focused, more specific. And you know the ability. To find those communities and. Integrate with them. You know this. Is not that hot too. 

00:09:41 Stephan Livera 

Yeah, now another concern people might have is that if I move somewhere, the communities I try to join, they may be very transient and that there’s no real way for me to set down routes and maybe to some extent there’s a little bit of truth there. But I think maybe there are other ways to mitigate that. So, what’s your approach there? 

CoinsureNZ 00:10:00  

Yeah, I mean that is a valid criticism. I think it does depend. On like where you are talking. About right, like. You know, if we talk about, say, Mexico right you know there are there are areas like take Playa del Carmen, Puerto Vallarta, you know, stuff like that where yeah, you know it is very transient. You know, you get a lot of people who will come and, you know, in the summer or the winter or whatever. Sorry. The yeah, whatever the time is advantageous for them. I’ll be here for two or three months and then they’ll go back to maybe the home country. Or some other spots. Or whatever and you know you build up a circle of friends and then they’re gone. And, you know, I’ve experienced that. And that could be a thing. But also, you know, there. Are a lot of areas. Some are similar those. We do have. A lot of. Long term, expat retiree people who? Aren’t so transient and you? Know aren’t so moving around. So, I mean think it is it depends on. Your location it depends on the. People that you associate with too and I think that to me. that is the real skill. Or the thing that you’ve gotta. Work towards is generally. When you begin this journey right, you know you don’t, you’re not. Thinking about some of these. Subtleties and some of these distinctions. But you know there are different types of people with different types of needs. And let’s just say for example, like families, big priority, right, then they are probably going to be. Wanting to find. Something more stable right now if. You’re particular circumstances. Interests aren’t something that lends itself to what people who have a family are likely to do. You’re probably not gonna meet these people. A permanent and associate with them beginning up with. A different group. Of people and you know these people. And then since may well be the transient type. Right, you know, so I think. It’s also like you know when it’s being a bit more aware certainly versus. You know what? Most people have that are just stable on one city or country you know, working in the place where they. Not too far. From where born or maybe they move around once or twice, you know where they have this ability to choose their location. A lot of people don’t kind of think about well, every time I go I can start again, right. And I can create a new. Reality I can. Create new group of friends and new social. Space if I’m. Not direct. If I’m not actively deciding. Like what those interests? Are I’m going to go with? You know what? Wherever the wind blows me. Or wherever my emotions would take. And those places may not be advantageous for maybe in connection with, you know, companies long term goals, right? So sometimes you gotta sit down and think, Okay, well, you. Know if I’m really into. You know, building. More long-term stable relationships.  Should I be help people that want to go to the bar? Friday, for example. Or do I want to give to a sport or you know something that you know with more? Children friendly they’re gonna be people that have children are likely to be again or, you know, stable and. Moving around, but again I think. Like that’s, you know, we’ll talk about this more, but. I don’t think the. Moving around life is. Necessarily a bad thing, either, right, you know. It can be It’s a little stressful and can. Be a little. Difficult people to accustomed to, but I think there’s a lot of advantages also to not being so stable places so. 

Stephan Livera 00:12:50  

Yeah, and it allows you to experience more of different parts of the world and you know, people like they have different flavors as they may like, right. Maybe you like Asian cuisine or maybe you like the culture. Maybe it’s a conservative culture in this particular. Eastern European country. Or maybe it’s, you know, a certain kind of attitude that people sort of have in, I don’t know, South America or Central America. And you kind of enjoy being around those kinds of people. So, I guess and obviously you know taxes also having you know being able to have lower taxes, it can also be appealing that that’s not the thing for everybody. So, when it comes to looking where in the world, obviously I get the sense that for you you’re focused more towards, let’s say, Central America and South America. Is there a reason for that? So, what’s your thinking there? 

CoinsureNZ 00:13:40  

I mean somewhat coincidence, you know, coincidence selling here because you know my story, you know, took about this and the last time I talked to us, you know, I kind of ended up here because of COVID, where I was previously in Asia in. Bali, when this happened and then. Ended up in Australia, where my parents. Where and then need to get out immediately is you. Know you would now would well know about. What was going on at that time? So, I ended up in Mexico just because it was open and I had a very long visa that allowed me, you know, Okay, well, I’ve got six months to figure out what I’m gonna do next. And who knows how long this is gonna go right. So I kind of landed there by accident. But, you know, when I was here, I realised how much. That sense and. To me the. Reasons I would suggest. Latham over Asia, I mean the main. Areas that people suggest for this right is you. Know if you’re looking somewhere. You get the best value. For money, right, it’s usually Eastern Europe. Sort of area. Uh Asia and it’s Latin America, right? And generally, those are the zones where. You kind of get the best value. For your dollar and the reason, I would suggest Latham over the other two is that it’s much more centralized in a particular time zone, right. So, you do have some variants, but it’s a lot more narrower. Kind of vertical, right and horizontal. The spring language wise if you learn Spanish, you’ve got every country in Latin. America, but Brazil? And you, you kind of bullhit your way through Portuguese? Not really, but I mean it. It’s a lot easier to pick up the basics if you know Spanish, right? So one language gives you all those options versus. Asia, recent European and a lot of. The different ones where it’s very. Right. Residency and also tax option-wise, I think it’s a lot better in this area and you have a lot. More options than. You do in the other two, you know, generally in in Asia and Latin America, sorry, in and Eastern Europe, they’re a lot more expensive. They’re a lot more complicated. The Bears are entry a lot higher whereas you know this part of the world. There’s quite a few options that you have and a bunch of them have to be territorial tax companies, countries as well. So that has it added advantage. Time zone is another one. I mean it depends where you work and what you do, but you know obviously America is a big earner and for a lot of people you know they at least have some business in the United States. And trying to work those hours in Azure is really sucks. Europe is kind of doable, but in Latin America, you know it’s more or less the same and maybe you got now to be the way. But you know, it’s very much aligned. With that, there. So yeah, I mean. I think for all those reasons to me, you know, again it wasn’t like I’d actually sat down and figured this out because, you know, when I was in Asia I was Still just beginning this journey I even start thinking about this stuff So, I come to land here by accident. But you know now that I’ve looked at all the options and understood everything, I think Latin America makes a lot more sense than other places, just for those reasons there. So, it’s simpler and you can tick double, you kind of multiply your work, right. You know, you learn one language, you’ve got all these countries rather have to learn Thai, Cambodian Anybody in Indonesia and you know whatever so yeah. 

Stephan Livera 00:16:38  

Yeah, Okay, great. and so, you recently got a new residency as well. So, do you want to just tell us a little bit about that, and you know why you picked that a little bit about that process. 

CoinsureNZ 00:16:49  

Yeah, so now I’m president in Mexico, Panama and Paraguay. And, you know, previously, you know, I had Mexico and Panama. And I had. Both those in 2021 and Paraguay was something which, at the same time I was investigating Panama. You know, I was Looking into and. And you know, it seemed to have some of the same benefits most people told me, like you. Know Panama’s better option and this was the time And the friendly nations visa was still in the old system. It was a lot easier to get and you know, they’re not like it is now. It’s bit harder. And Panama is quite as appealing as it was. So anyway, I did those two and. And, you know, I think, well, yeah, I’ve got the boxes pretty well. Covered with these. Two right, you. Know. So I think it’s a great place to live text wise if you’re permanently basing yourself here and everything is very clearly set in Mexico, it’s not such. An ideal place to be. But if you have other options and you’re able to make sure that you set things up correctly, you know it’s a great place. To be to balance this out in. Panama, you know, is it is. Definitely not a feral place at all, but. You know, it’s probably not. My #1. Versus Mexico, but it, you know, it has a text. All the boxes about the tax residency and where you’re basing yourself, at least on paper in Mexico. But so you know, I wasn’t really. I was gonna have, you know, never any Paraguay. Similar system that was at the time to Panama, we basically put 5000 U.S. dollars on a bank account. Yeah. Get your birth certificate and various things like this. Wait a few months and then you have your permanent residency. In this job. Done right. So I was looking at that for a while. But you know what? What? What changed my mind was now that it was on the radar because Paraguay’s. Not a country. That most people know anything about, right? Like what? What is? Paraguay, like most people, can’t tell. You anything about the country? But the more that I. Was aware of it, so I think about it the more. I started run into people. In various types of circles, not just Bitcoin one. And nomad spaces and people that are entrepreneurs and things, and how often this. Thing came up. You know something very interesting to me. You know, maybe there is something here this to get it more. And like, you know, it’s much easier to file attention to a pair of what you want. The full months rub than six to be able. To qualify to. Follow on there. You know it has certain advantages because it’s in. Mercosur, which you can’t fully take advantage of. As a resident. That you know you can. Kind of ride in the cocktails a little. Out of that. And so yeah, you know, the more I started thinking about it, looking at it, the more it made sense and you know what, it really comes down to me of kind of what I would say. That the reason. To do it is and Why I think it’s? Good idea is. Obviously, if it’s your first residency, then you know. Like you, you have. The advantage of all the tax benefits and things like that, but for someone like me. You know who? Already has this things all ticked off. Dude, you know, I think it’s. Like really it’s like a Country Club almost. It’s what? It is right, it’s. The networking so the people. That you will meet there while you are. Living there but. Also abroad, who you know share some stuff. And  Paraguay are coming and going from Paraguay they are the sort of people where there’s a particular type person, right? Because you. Know what I like about Paraguay? Versus say, these other digital Nomad hotspots might here like Bangkok or Medellin or Del Carmen or Istanbul or something? Like that like this. Paraguay sucks. And I mean that in the best way in. Terms of like I love. The place. But these people who are like fear. With the nomads, they’re never kind of Paraguay, you. Know there’s no like, yeah. There is a there’s definitely a nightlife. There is definitely nice places to visit, you know there. Is beaches the? Beaches on the. River. But there’s not these things that generally pull these people. Who are there to party it up and? They’re more casual, right? The only. Reason that you’re in Paraguay? Is that you have done your homework. And you. Interested in minimizing your tax burden? And you’ve looked at jurisdictional arbitrage and? You’ve realized that this is. A very, very good option and a very affordable. Option for that. Kind of thing there, so you know it. Is like a. Filter in terms of you know if you are one of these people that’s moving around. And moving on. These circles you meet. A lot of. People which nothing against these people at all, but they’re not the same. They’re nothing about. Things the same way that I am right, they have a different lifestyle. And you know, for me, I’m more interested in meeting people that are on the same wavelength and the same  headspace that I am. I think Paraguay is a great filter for that, so yeah. They’re kind of the main reasons why I ended up there, even though I already had kind of a lot of the boxes from pair of locksets. But I’m very glad that I did because I really, you know, I was not expecting a lot to be honest with you when I went down I thought well, let’s get this plan C done and check it out. But the more that I spent time in the country. And really good to. Know with the more. I realized wow, this is actually a very livable. A very good place, so yeah. 

Stephan Livera 00:21:27  

Yeah, that’s great to hear. And so. I guess is this the end of getting residencies for you or you’re still, you know, keeping your mind and eyes open for other options that are out there? 

CoinsureNZ 00:21:39  

Yeah, I mean, definitely, yes, I mean like, you know absolutely, you know, doing the stuff is a pain in the ash, right, you know, do your homework about it. Obviously first try and find someone, you know, you know, somebody thinks you can do yourself, but generally, especially if it’s like you’re not fluent in the native language, you’re not familiar with some of the in and out. It’s well worth you paying some money to have. Someone to do the process with you. Or for you, right. So, you know there’s investigating the process itself. There’s funding that person who’s reputable, trustable. Then there’s. Yeah, flying to the place doing. All the paperwork. Going to the Immigration office or whatever it is. And then yeah, you. Don’t need to get these things. But you know, generally you know a bank account, there’s a drivers lice. And there’s other bits and pieces that need. To be procured. And you know, going through this bureaucracy. Particularly in Latin America, you know is can be tiring and draining. So, for me, you know I. Think I’m pretty well. Said. And I think this thing can once you really go down the rabbit hole, can become a bit. Of an obsession, but you know. Yeah, I’m not closing. My eyes off to it, you know, I mean, I think. Like to me probably what would make sense to something in Asia, but it may you know, I mean it’s like probably your best option if you are not gonna like permanently set yourself up there long term or some like the title visa and you know that’s like what is it like 25 grand? I think you know it’s a lot of money to put down for somewhere for. Like 5 years, I believe that’s you that, you know, there’s just really, you know, not that many great options around the world that are as good as the ones that you can have in Latin America. And so, part of it for me as well, you know, what am I really gonna get out of these other places? I don’t think a ton of a lot. So, I’ve got my eyes open and, you know, hopefully you’ll see more of these things. Pop up sometime in the in the coming years. But for me. Right now, yeah, I don’t take it. Yeah, you’re. Too break out of this stuff. Just kind of Build what I’ve set up rather than. Be chasing you know the things around the lot, yeah. 

Stephan Livera 00:23:29  

Yeah. And I guess there might also be a little bit of maintenance required for each thing that you have, like if you were to get another one or do you need to spend a certain amount of time there or kind of upkeep to pay for things? And I guess these are some factors that you might consider also. 

CoinsureNZ 00:23:43  

Yeah, for all the ones that I have there I mean the like Panama and Paraguay. Do have a. Minimum visit component but it’s like 2 days every two years you know. So, it’s not a hard thing to. If you’re on this probably like, maybe if you. Were back in New Zealand, you know, having to schedule a trip to Panama. We have no reason to go to Panama, then to all the reasons you might be inconvenient. But for me, you know, it’s not a pain at all to retain them. But yeah, you’re very right. I mean, there’s something for me. Where? I think somewhere like El Salvador is not such a good deal in terms of. It has to regional tech system in certain circumstances. But you know the biggest turn off for me is well, this is a six month residency within that. You know remaining within the country requirement to retain. Their residency and. 

Stephan Livera 00:24:27  

That’s the Riverside residency. 

CoinsureNZ 00:24:29 

Yeah, and you know El Salvador is not a bad country at all. But, you know, I just think when you have these other options in front of you, why would you choose, you know, why would you commit yourself, track yourself to this place for six months when you could have? Something with these benefits without that. 

Stephan Livera 00:24:43  

Yeah, I see. Interesting. So yeah, because that was going to be one of my other questions of, you know, you’re in South America and Central America. Why not El Salvador? But I guess that you’ve answered that. Yeah. And so then I guess you just got to think about in each place that you go to, you have to get figured out in terms of what place are you going to rent, where you gonna get your groceries, where are you gonna, how you gonna pay the bills if you, you know, if you’re earning Bitcoin or you might need to sell some Bitcoin for cash. So you might need local contacts for that or OTC traders. For that, so can you talk us through a little bit of the process there of like how you figure it out for each place? 

CoinsureNZ 00:25:19  

Yeah. So, I mean, I think what is very advantageous is the find online communities, you know printers and reason that I still have a Facebook account is I did talk to my parents early on that, but be you know I find that if you go in there and you search X place in country X or city X You can find some very. Good useful information from that where you can. Just search it’s already written or just. Go straight up there and ask and more people are very. Helpful and I’ll give this information. There’s a lot to go down telegram groups as well. Like, you know, if you’re in this world. You know the. The my late in life one I think is a good one. That’s right recently. Where you know you can get. A lot of this. Information answered and you know people are quite willingly. Sharing all these kind. Of things you know, like for example. I went to Brazil. Recently and Brazil. Is a very logistically complicated country. For foreigner, like if you. Don’t have the tax out of. Your super fit or right It’s There’s a lot of things. Which you assume you can get, which you can’t and things like ATM. It’s very hard to find. An ATM you. Can actually get cash. Out with a foreign car so. You know, being able to. Like miss someone? Say, hey, what’s going on here? Won’t come and get some money and say, oh, well, no, you gotta go to. This one specific type of ATM and. He can tell you like, where it is. You know, this is a very, very useful thing to have, so doing your Homework and find these communities and give me answers from there. I think it’s a big one. I think you know you’ve also got. A like there’s a trade off here, right? Like you want to explore the options that are available to you and do not want to, like, just pick a place on the map and commit to it Because, you know, it may not be the best place or it may you know what you read about it. It’s not what? You actually find you. Give there now, but at the same time you know especially the country like Mexico it’s, you know, it’s as big as the United States, as much variety. You can spend decades. Trying to, you know, understand Mexico and where it is right, at some point you’ve got to decide, Okay. Well, this is good enough and I’m. Happy with that, right? So, you know, I think you’re trying. To do a bit. Of homework about where you’re going and trying to get some of that stuff done. Before, but also leave your. Options open about, you know, trying to plan your itinerary where you’re not just going to fully commit to one place gonna check out a few things before you do. I think that’s probably an important one to look into and to check out. Yeah. And when you’re on the grounds. Yeah, a lot of, like, expat meetups, which again, you know, you’ll find through this online communities is a really important thing, you know, make some friends, catch up with some people. If you’re in a big metropolis like, say, Mexico City, you know, there’s a ton of events going on and. 

CoinsureNZ 00:27:46  

A ton of communities and groups, so you can. You find some really nice interests. Or some like Paraguay. You know, it’s a lot smaller, but you know the X. There’s just like a general X Pats meet up there. That happens every month and it’s a really good meet up like a really good group of people and everyone just super helpful and super friendly. And you know, I’ve asked gone there and asked. Many questions about. Like, hey, you know, where do you? Find this what’s the best place, what’s best bank or the best? Location to get this that done and you get all those questions answered. So, find those communities participating in them it’s a pretty big one and yeah, you know I think we talked about this last time with you know, give yourself enough time as well. Like I would say a month minimum is what you want the space. Generally I find fun. Enough just magically always seems to be. Exactly a month after you’re the you start to the friends start to pop up and things start to jump out of the woodwork. And for like the first month you’re like, I don’t know if this is working is it’s too much. I should. I just go back home or whatever. And after a month it magically happens. So. So give yourself enough time. I think is another. One and yeah, they’ve. Been the main ones you know. Do your homework. Find some good online people to connect with. Do you know? And you seem to help narrow down what you’re after, but also give yourself a good. Amount of time to check out the. Space that you’re going to and don’t over. Commit to one like. See if. You can if. It’s possible you know, two months, three months, to check out three spaces. Is probably a good idea as well. 

Stephan Livera 00:29:08  

Yeah, And when it comes to a place in each location or jurisdiction, are you thinking about having like a storage unit in each place to save you money instead of having to rent year round in all three places or, you know, or are there places where maybe it’s cheap enough that you would just literally rent a place for? Around it’s even if you’re not spending the full year there. How? Do you think about that? 

CoinsureNZ 00:31:33  

Yeah, I mean this is an issue I’m dealing with right now because you know when I first came to Latin America it was during COVID and really there wasn’t a lot of point in moving around right. It was within, you know, the country within Mexico. Yeah. But I mean, you know, I was during that time and playable calm and was pretty much the best place to be where ever else is. A lot more. Closed and regulated. And you know, the expat communities fund. Is good. Where? It’s like everyone was kind of concentrated in these. Spaces during cell trying to get away from what it was going on at home. Right. So, you know, during that time I just like rented a place for pretty much entirety of a of a year and a half or whatever it was and that that made the most sense, right? Whereas now everything’s opened up. I’m trying to make it, most of it, you know, I’m speaking a bunch of conferences. I’m going swimming out these residencies. Trying to check out a few other countries in the area. Right. And so I pretty for a year now I’ve. Been sort of. Living out of hotels. And B&B’s and the issue is. Of course, you know like, well, you. Can either have diminish all your positions down to carry on because I keep travelling with chicken it’s possible, but it’s just gonna get too. Trust me. It’s gonna get too logistically annoying. So you can reduce if you then you have down to carrying on, which is possible but not really. For me, it wasn’t the right option, you know. So yeah. I mean, storage unit was the best. So this is pretty much how. I live now is I have 3 storage units. And I have. Like a. A carbon copy of more or less the same stuff from all of them, so I can show up in these countries with like literally. Nothing like I could show up naked And make it and I would have everything I need, you know, a computer, you know. Full set of. Clothes you know, shorts, long pants, shoes, socks, you. Know the whole. Whole thing set up there so I can just show up there and your creature. Comforts like you know, like small. Coffee machine and stuff like that, so no matter. Where you are. Going or like? What your accommodation is gonna be like? How remote? You can show up there and just like. Swap out your equipment for the next adventure. Come back change. It over and. Do that you know. So, for example, you know, just been in Paraguay where you know it’s quite hot and then, you know, I’ve gotta go to Riga for a conference there. And obviously, you know you want. A different to close there. 

CoinsureNZ 00:33:48  

So, you know, gives you the ability. To you know, to swap out the uniform. If you like, you know depending on what you. Need to do and yeah, I mean. So, you could do that instead of doing that, you could rent a place in different spaces, and I guess that depends on your income, like if you. Know you’re a billionaire. Why would you not rent like a multi penthouse And these three locations? Rather than you know, than in a storage unit, but I thank you. I mean, I looked at this for quite a while and really kind of thought about it and obviously storage unit is a lot cheaper. You know the cheapest absolutely cheapest. You’d find a place for. You know Latin America, you know even some of my paragraph was quite cheap is sort of 300 bucks a month. And that’s probably not going to be the best place where you know, if you live in. There you want don’t want to be miserable, right? So, you know you’re. Probably looking more like $1000. A month and. You know, if you’re doing that two Or three places, that’s. You know, and you not may not. Be living in either of them for a. Particular point of time. You know, I was in Europe for a month this year, you know that’s a lot of money going down the drain. And so, to me it seemed to make the most sense to the Storage unit thing which you know it’s a little. And convenient. Let’s say, you know, like, you know. I really appreciate what I used to have where you could take a flight and you come back. Your fridge is full of stuff to get, you know your clothes are in the closet. You know, you don’t have to communicate with some person about a check in time. You know, you have to get to the storage unit and get to the place or whatever, you know. But I think like for most people, I would recommend that. That is, while you are traveling around and your existence is more transient, that’s the simplest way to solve it and. And if you’re like, are. American. And you’re in Latin America, for example, you. Know you could feasibly. It would make more sense to have it with your with your base, but I mean you could see somebody have one in the United States and go and swap over things for six months or four months. What to? Bring them back in. A suitcase. But you know for. Me. Like you know, I’m. Not trying to New Zealand every time, I want to, you know, do some of this sort of stuff and I’ve got. No real intention of. Maintaining any sort of. Long term existence there. So. To me, this made a lot of sense too, of like well, I want to have some positions that are more than a backpack And I’ve really got it created by somewhere and you know I’m. Not going to. Be able to leave. I’m not going to, like, rent a place for six months or a year or whatever. Just get a surge and then sleep you so much more options of when it’s time to get something more permanent, if that’s what you do, it’s easier to cancel that and the Upkeep is very low and yeah, just give to that functionality. So, I think, yeah. To me, that’s the optimal solution I figured out for the moment, but yeah, I mean. It can get a. Little. Sometimes you just want your familiar place. And go back to so you know, maybe I might change your mind to that at some point. 

Stephan Livera 00:36:26  

Yeah, that that all make. A lot of sense. Obviously, the storage units are going to be a lot cheaper, so that’s a much more cost-effective way to achieve things. Curious as well how you’re seeing the residency market shift and change because what we’ve seen is certain programs have either raised the price or made it more or made it more. Difficult. More bureaucracy. How are you seeing that in terms of Latin America and residency programs?  

CoinsureNZ 00:36:54  

I mean I think overall it’s getting more difficult and more expensive. You know there’s couple where I’m not too familiar with Colombia in details because I’ve looked at. That, and it’s not really. My killer fish. But I know they’ve made their slightly more complicated for residents there. Definitely Panama, you know the translations. These changed since 2021, where now you’ve got this, like, kind of two-year temporary thing and, you know, it’s quite hard to get that temporary Regency, this kind of axle as you get around it. But you know that that’s become more difficult. Paraguay. It’s still, you know, quite easy, but, you know, for example, there’s an. Interesting development that they’ve well first. Off actually, when I was first looking at this. It was permanent. Residency. As I said, you know, for five grand in the bank and then you withdraw late, you got permanency for life and more or less you gotta renew. Your card every 10 years. That’s it. 

CoinsureNZ 00:37:44  

So, I was looking at that in October and I thought like maybe I’ll do this. In February and then. This is actually an interesting cautionary tale. You know, they just literally 2 weeks later, they just like that changed the system. And I’ve been thinking because watching with Panama is when they changed the animations visa they gave you, like, warning. There’s about 90 days. We’re like, this is always going to change in nine days, so a lot of people gone the last minute you had the time to get the documents, to get to Panama, to do the stuff to get the residency risk. Paraguay, they just changed. It instantly right and. So they’re, you know, literally people who landed. The day before that had the appointment. The day after it. That, but now we’re. Just you know. Unable to do the process, so they changed their system to. What Paraguay has now where you. In some ways it’s easier because before you had to have that lump sum. Of money to prove like solvency, whereas now all. You need is a birth certificate. Criminal record or proof of no criminal record. And that’s it to. You know that you need to be able to get residency there, so it’s become easier, but you know You’ve got a. Two year waiting period and then as I understand it, that’s still some of this is still being looked up as I understand it from what I’ve seen, it’s gonna be. Like the old system, you gotta put the 5000 bank and then you can get permanent. So, things are. Getting more complicated, they are getting more. Difficult, and I think the sense that I get is this.  Is that you? Know pre COVID and certainly you know pre remote working become more of a thing you know. These programs were designed. For people who. Are retirees or hiding with individuals that? Investments in things you know that were able to move around and they’re geared towards. We want these people, right and you know, we kind of have this good fortune for people that are on that boat, where if you’re a remote worker, you can technically qualify for this. Because, you know, these are kind. Of based on the assumption. Well, people that didn’t have the sort. Of money or it didn’t have. That sort of lifestyle aren’t gonna be able. To just you. Know travel as frequently as from a workers are so remote work. And then of course COVID of a lot of people start to look into this and think about this a lot more has really made this stuff a lot more. 

CoinsureNZ 00:39:47  

Popular and you can see that you know like these. Things are getting more and more known and these names. Are getting more and more out there. And so I think my sense would be that, you know, these countries know about this. They see a business opportunity and they also see that maybe that’s not collecting that kind of clientele that we were intending. Certainly that as I understand, that’s why the friendly nations were changed. So, yeah, I mean, my assumption would be. That these things are going to close sooner rather than later. And if you’re interested, you really want to get on to it sooner. Rather might because you know these opportunities are not gonna be there. I mean, like, hopefully you will see other countries realizing, hey, there’s an. Opportunity to get you know what? What are your options here if you. Up the income. And the, you know, the education level, etc. Of your people, I mean you. Can invest in decades long. Programs to rest, schooling and things like this. Or you can just import a bunch of people that are not too culturally dissimilar that are gonna follow these criteria, which means they integrate well and. So, I think there are. Countries that are going to also realize that, though. You know about well. Hey, it’s to our advantage to get these guys. In as long. As we can keep them in some way, we. Can make sure. That we get. Benefits from them. So, I think you know, I could see a. World where this? Wall could come back the other way, but for now, you know, I think that the window is closing more than is opening and who knows where this hypothetical idea is saying. But opening up again may take place, you know. 

Stephan Livera 00:41:06  

Yeah. Interesting. And so there are arguments and points going both ways on that. So for example, there are some countries who are opening up digital nomad visas, right? They are, it’s literally called a digital nomad visa, right. So, there are countries who are opening that up. But on the other hand, you have, let’s say, some tension sometimes. And maybe the locals don’t like that. So probably a famous example is in Portugal that there were some flare ups there. From what I understand where. Some of the locals. Had a concern that they were getting priced out of their local property markets because of all the people buying golden visas and things like this buying property and so then they I believe the Portuguese Government changed the program such that you could no longer get golden visa by buying property in Lisbon. And maybe one or two other places because they were the popular ones and they sort of shifted the program because they. Where you know, there was pressure from locals. So, have you seen any of that in terms of LATAM? 

CoinsureNZ 00:42:07  

Yeah, I mean. When you talk about, say, gentrification and then that kind of stuff, it’s a little, it depends on the depends on the country. I mean I’m. Not super familiar with Portugal, I’ve. Been plenty of times, but I’m not like super never spend an extended amount of time there, so you know, I would feel I can totally comment on like you know the atmosphere. In the Air there versus here. But it seems to me like things in Portugal. Have been gone for. Quite a long while And they’ve got to that particular states. Yeah, they’re quite a bit more advanced. Than I think land and is and. That’s, you know that there’s in Europe, it’s proximity to other places. You know, it’s a long history with England and things like this public place to go with some of these other places, a bit more scary. So you know, I mean I. Think you know there is. There a little, but not certainly not. A place like Paraguay, people like why are you a Paraguayan like man? Wow. Awesome. You know the. Foreign. Yeah, you know. And Mexico and like certain specific? Parts of Mexico. Yeah, like you know, kind of bit of meme. Now about like you know the. Zona Gringo, if they call it like, you know, like Roma Condesa, Polanco. You know, that kind of area, you know that you know that gentrification is happening and prices are. Going up, but I mean these areas too. Are always off limits to most of. You know most Mexicans. Are for the Rich kind of people and stuff like that. So, you know. It’s kind of the people. So I mean, I think a little bit, it’s not a very strong thing. I think in in, sorry, in, in Latin America, I think you know a lot of people here more than in other areas you know kind of see it more as like hey if you come. And you bring in money. Great. You know, come on in. So yeah, it’s that strong. And when it comes to the Digital Nomad visas, I mean, yeah, they’re positive. But the other thing to remember with those is like they are temporary visas for a particular center time. And if you want to explore a space, you know, like a. Good example of it. Is Brazil where, you know Brazil is, they’re a bit more hard to ask. Colombia is like this. To wear uh. If you’re someone like Bali or. McCann Indonesia or Thailand. You know, it’s quite easy to do this perpetual piece of run thing, right? Where you just. Drop the border every 90 days, six days where it maybe giving visa and there’s people have been living there for, you know, 10 years like that, right? Where countries like Colombia and Brazil, they do not intend that they’ll bounce you at the border if you’ve spent more than 90 days and. Six months or whatever their criteria is. So you know, the digital nomad visa for Brazil, for example. You know, as I understand, to get a year and you know. That’s a bit of. A difficult thing to do in. Brazil, so it’s an option and but it’s not resonancy right. You know it’s a. Good way to explore the country and. Get your head. Around. But you know, maybe may. Well, be that you. Can get six digital nomad visas This is in. But you know, that’s very much up to the government that can change a lot. Oftentimes these don’t quite give you the rights about opening bank accounts and other things that firmly establishing a base in the country that you know, permanent temporary residency may do. So, I think like. These notes. Are good, but it’s not that good. Deal for you, I think. If your ambitions are solely transitory, just want to check the place out for 3-4, six months a year and that’s all you have money it’s fine. But if you are trying to. Do flake theory and really base yourself in somewhere else really get established? They’re not Quite what I Think people think that they are right. They’re a good introduction, but they’re not gonna give the rights and the abilities that he wants out of, you know reasons. 

Stephan Livera 00:45:34  

Yeah, Okay, that’s a really good point. I hadn’t considered that. So yeah, definitely makes sense to bias towards getting some kind of residency or some other thing and in you know, in some cases, maybe that’s for people who are at the higher net worth level. They’re looking at buying a passports or citizenship by investment, that kind of thing. And of course, yeah. As you said, getting residency in particular, some of these countries where you’re planning to try to put down some roots or whether or get a security get a storage locker at least even if you’re not renting a place. 

CoinsureNZ 00:46:08  

Yeah, I mean and your virtual your. Mileage will vary, right, you know. Like the digital? Nomad thing may work. Those pieces may work in certain countries, and you may find a certain branch, a certain bank, that will open a bank account for you with. That visa, right? But generally as a rule, you know. This is not when you were a temporary resident. You know you’ll see this with things like drivers, licenses and other. Stuff right where? You know, often there are rules, regulations that clearly make these distinctions right and a Digital Nomad These are. I wouldn’t be surprised to find that. Some of them will look at. That very differently than temporaries and on. The permanent reason So again, yeah, do your homework and look into this stuff and This is kind of like an emerging space where it may change and the information. It may not be there available out there. But it’s something to consider and I think like if your goal is really, you know giving different flags and something more permanent that you should be looking at those kinds of residencies rather than Digital Nomad. 

Stephan Livera 00:47:04  

Yeah, Also I’m curious if you’ve seen overall growth in the numbers now. Of course, I’m not expecting you to have like exact numbers, but do you get a sense that there are more people doing this kind of, let’s call it Digital Nomad or Bitcoin Nomad or whatever you want to call it? Do you get a sense that the, you know, the groups are growing or that there’s more people doing this? Or do you think it was more like a temporary rise during COVID and now it’s kind of dropped back down after? 

CoinsureNZ 00:47:31  

Yeah, a little. It’ll have to gauge. I mean, anecdotally, I would say in the places that I go, I would Say that I Think overall it has. Increased. It’s hard for me to say because again, I wasn’t really In the start well Before COVID. But yeah, I mean, I think. It’s only getting more and more the volume is only increasing. Is my kind of thing and. I think probably. I would say is an accurate statement. Like that for the population in general, there’s probably more people who are afraid or apprehensive about travelling during the COVID period than there are now, right? So, I really think that it’s a general statement and more people who are interested in working remote and are trying it out now than there was. I mean COVID, you know, the only backlash to that would be, I think during that period it was kind of new. So, kind of got ambushed on a few employers and also they’re trying out, but you are seeing a bit of a backlash, you know it’s in the news quite a bit about some, some large you know corporations putting some caps and some rules on this about time lengths or you know you can Nomad you can work remote, but it can. Only be within the your continental United States or whatever it might be something like that, right? So, all 5050, but I mean. I think it’s more like the. Cat is out of the bag. Now, where people who didn’t even consider this as a possibility realize, hey? I can do this. What is this gonna mean? And you know, there’s a lot of people. When they’re kind of online communities, I see it’s not just taxes or. You know or lifestyle or kind of this lifestyle and but a lot of things like dating, you know, like a lot of them are like, you know, I’m not that much like where I. Am where I don’t. Like you know, where the way that the culture in general of my country is going and I feel like you know. Woman or me? And I’m sure it’s probably their sponsors. We had too. But, you know, women are much more traditional in this particular country, and they’re much more appreciative of, you know, what I have to offer in aggregate than they would be in, in a western country. So, you know, I think there’s a lot of movements I bet like if you feel like passport Bros thing, you know, which is all guys who go get. 

Stephan Livera 00:49:33  

Yeah, a part of this, yeah. 

CoinsureNZ 00:49:35  

Their passport to go and. You know you know date. Let’s put it that way. A woman from Vladimir or other countries like that, right? And that’s kind of like a wholly separate genre from these people that are from that jurisdiction up charge tax and stuff. But they all kind of have. Purged in the same kind of space where a lot of people are realizing that there are much better options available to me and I. Can take advantage. Of them, with the world that we live in. Today. so, I Think it’s only. Getting bigger and these sub genres are only gonna increase. 

Stephan Livera 00:50:03  

Yeah, I think that I think it makes a lot of sense, right, the it’s kind of people who are going overseas, but that’s for lower taxes or different dating environment for people who are dating. And you know, people are just realizing that, you know, the place where they are born is not necessarily the place they have to do everything in. And so. I’m also hearing more stories and I’m sure you’re seeing this as well. Is the rising cost of living in the Western nations, so we’re seeing even people in Canada, America, Australia, we’re seeing some of these videos of people saying I can’t make ends meet. You know, it’s costing too much even on, you know, at a decent salary or an average salary, they can’t make it work there. And then I’m curious if you’re seeing that where people. Let’s say they can’t make it work in the Western country because just the cost of living has gone up so high that they actually, for that reason, they’re moving to LATAM or Asia or other places. 

CoinsureNZ 00:50:57  

Yeah, absolutely. I think like without a doubt, you know normally you get a better bang for your bucks or even if it’s not that your breadline like that and you’re doing it completely unnecessary, it’s like well, you know, I’m gonna spend $2000 on an apartment and somewhere in the United States with whereas what I’m gonna get. And Latam for that is significantly better, right? So, I Think people are. Looking for better options, but yes, I’ve also seen people like that a lot of people that are like trying to start their own thing right where you know they’ve worked at a time at a company and maybe they’ve exited with some equity or you know they’ve just saved that much money. And they decided, Okay. I’ve got a. Pet project I wanna really give it a go? So, I’m gonna set myself up somewhere where I can minimize my cost of living and get my burn rate, if you’re like. As low as possible and just try this for a year and see if it happens right. And I think you get a lot of people like that coming here now. I mean it, it does need to be said, you know the same inflation increase cost of living, you absolutely are seeing it in this side of the world, right? You know, things are going up. General cost of living is definitely increasing and in a country like Mexico as well, you see the more because you know the. The Super pace. So, as they’re calling it, this, you know, has. Gone up versus the US dollar, I mean. Like traditionally it’s. Been like 20 pesos for one.  for the longest amount of time. And now it’s. Like I’ve looked. At it for a little bit like16 So you know that is having a big effect on people and in Mexico for example, you know so it’s not all like roses, but I mean like if you’re the impression that I certainly have is that if you are and money is your really burning issue certainly even in a country like Mexico which. Is probably the. Most getting to be one of the more expensive. Options Just because of the exchange. Rate and if you know if you’re not picky about. Being in a bustling metropolis, if you are willing to go out, you know in in the wilderness a little, you know like. Then there’s still some crazily cheap deals available way. Better than anything else you’re gonna get in a western country, but not just saying you know something I see when you go to America is, you know, you get paid a lot more money in America generally. But you know, they know how to pack it out of you. Every you know every possible place you know, and so there aren’t. So, like the general cost of like going about your day-to-day business, I think in this part of the world are definitely  a lot lower. So that you know there be the other one I think too of you know. That you know it is rising here too. But I think generally, you know the cost of just existing and what you need to survive especially if you set things up correctly and this is what you’re organizing thing around in this part of. World this year is significantly lower. 

Stephan Livera 00:53:30  

Yeah. Interesting. And yeah, in terms of having a low burn rate, I know Chiang Mai in Thailand is another common place that people do that kind of idea where because the cost of living is, so can be very low. That’s a common place that people try that kind of idea of. I’m going to have a really low burn rate. I’m gonna go here and try to set up a business. And try to, you know, make it. That way I’m curious if you have any insights on, you know, common failure reasons like what are some things that you know, people who, if you’ve seen like, people who tried it and failed, you know, were there any big mistakes that you thought they made anything like that? 

CoinsureNZ 00:54:07  

Yeah, I mean. I’ve seen a lot more of this. In these digital Nomad Hotspot places like, say, play a little common, right? You get a lot of people that come. And you certainly see this actually saw this. A lot, but when? I was there. Give these people that come and they. Just think I’m gonna show up and this is gonna materialize, right? You know, I’m gonna get there. I’m gonna open my laptop and business. Or, like, a business idea is gonna come out of the sky. Whatever. I’m gonna just start posting some photos on Instagram and somehow money is gonna materialize, right? And they realize there’s not gonna work, right? You need to have a plan. The strategy you need to, you know, save up effectively and have a very long. One way to be able to figure things out if. You’re not coming there. Right. So, like these people that arrive. They arrive without and then come stream or without an idea about how they’re gonna do this, so that’s how I think a lot of them leave, you know, in Bali it’s my they show up and they’re obviously they’re on their parents money and. Yeah, having a great time. The life of the party for three months and they mysteriously disappear. Off because the. The money ran out, right? And probably come you see a lot of people that think they’re gonna be a coach of some sort of description. And, you know, they realize that it’s. A very hard game to get. Into and you know they eventually doesn’t look out right, so you know, not sure with the. Plan and not sure with the runway. It’s probably one of the biggest. Ones you do see some people that leave just. Because they get a little bit. Of fatigue burning out right, like especially you know, if you’re not fluent with the language, you’re not willing to get over that hump, you know? It can be very fresh. Trying to do some pretty basic sort of day-to-day stuff. Right and. And they can start to. Get on your nerves. Right? You. Know like just your day-to-day. Stuff going to get groceries, you know, having to sort out this errand or that errands can become longer and a lot more irritating and draining because of the language barrier and the cultural barrier sometimes, well, you know. That’s not what’s going. On this time, driven as we are. In the West, you know? So that’s and I think where I think some people they miss the. Comforts of home they. Get frustrated with the just the. The general experience of living in this other kind of country, and that’s something I think you just have to try. You know, it’s not, not forever. And some people will realize and they’ll come to the conclusion that you know, for all the money that I’m saving. Our brother just has to deal with this. This Bullhit right. And uh you. Know it’s fair enough, I guess you. Know. So, they’re the main ones, I think and yeah. They’ll will be like sometimes you’ll.  Have issues, right? You know, a family emergency. There’s a health issue. Something else goes on and. They you know, they. Or rice should break up is another one. You see what people? Well, because life circumstances have changed and this is like no longer viable like it was so. Yeah. I mean, I think they’re probably the biggest ones. Just like. Show with the plan. Have a good runway to. Prepare for the unexpected and be, you know, be experience to be realistic about the learning curve and the you know the culture shock that you’re gonna experience and that it’s gonna come with frustrations, right? Things are gonna be cheaper and you’re gonna learn the dream in some ways and other ways. Like every time you. They go to, you know, get go to the bank or some. Like that to see like oh. My God, this is like half day. Experience now like. You know so, yeah, they’re the big ones. 

Stephan Livera 00:57:08  

Yeah, interesting. And I mean, I guess bottom line though, the whole point of this is that you can get more freedom or potentially lower taxes or lower cost of living or maybe there’s a particular culture that you really enjoy. I think those are probably the at the end of the day, if people are pursuing this, it’s because of. That reason? So, I guess if you had to sum up, you know why, why do all these things? Why even try to do this jurisdictional arbitrage thing? Well, how would? You sum it up for people. 

CoinsureNZ 00:57:38  

Yeah. So, I think what you just have shown certainly like taxes and having options about structuring your life, you know it’s advantageous like a simple one outside of Texas for example. I remember when I was stuck in Australia for a while, I don’t have a motorbike license in New Zealand and I was riding a motorbike a lot around in Bali, I think. Well, you know relate this. You know, make risk. Really into it or tried? It before and I would like to get my motorcycle license you in Australia, you could wait two years. Take this drivers course and you go through this regional role, whereas you know somewhere like, you know, Panama, it’s a hell simply just drive around a track once and you know some country just pay money and you got your license, right and their licenses internationally recognized, right. So there there’s advantages like that about if you have that other residency, you could maybe you can go to this other country and get things done or signed off another one maybe that might. Kind of more relevant to some listeners is, you know, a lot of exchanges. If you’re having to KYC in exchange, they will take a recency. Car is certainly a national ID as proof of residency. And so, depending on your jurisdiction and whatever things they’re, you know, I Mean if they are asking. If your country goes to that exchange and says, tell us all the details of citizens from this, from our country that are residents of your thing, if you. Have KYC, there’s a another jurisdiction. They’re not gonna find that information. So yeah, there’s some financial. Privacy stuff about that as well. Which, yeah, again, I would encourage you to look. Into that in detail. And not just take what I see it as. Carte blanche because there’s many saltiest to them. But that’s a that’s a plus, right? So, there’s some jurisdictional things that you can get out of this. I would say the biggest one, though for me that I think really enable it is, is a lifestyle thing. In terms of very much about like your quality of life and how much you enjoy things and how your life will turn out. It’s depending on your environment, right? And having the ability to have these options available to where it’s not just that you can go for a month or for a holiday, but you can base live your entire life in four or five, six different places instead of one Is a very big advantage, you know. For example. Another advantage of Powerball which I didn’t even really consider until I was just there, is at the moment it’s winter and right now in the whole hemisphere it is some. So, if you. Something’s right. You. Know you can be living perpetually in. The summer, right, you. Know you can just assume this. You know it. It starts to get. Towards window you shifted the other hemisphere. And you got. Out much more out of sunlight and much more. Nice kind of space if. If you enjoy the sun and also like beyond there giving more specific you know like maybe you really like the beach, but you were like snowboarding, right, you know or something. Some bizarre thing like that, or there’s one particular space that you’ve found. There’s really nice. And this time of year like for. Me, you know. I absolutely love like demurtas. Like here and here and here and now Mexico, you know? And so, you know. I want to be in Mexico in October, right, you know to take. Advantage of that, right? So. Being able to design a sketch. Or lifestyle, right where? You know you could be somewhere for two months and do what you know. We call like Monk mode, right? Like blood. Everything else. Just knuckle down, get some work done and he’s done for the year and. Then that’s out of the way, and then the rest of the. Ten months have you can relax a. Bit more and socialize and make. The place that is conducted. To you getting a ton of stuff done is not the place where you would like to socialize. Right? And. So being able to design your perfect schedule in terms of not just the physical location but the things that surround that. The options that are available to you which. Give you your ultimate life. I think that’s probably the biggest one, right, and that requires a bit of I’m working a bit of. Negation. But that’s really, I think the. Ultimate goal is like. Never being in a place where you think, man, this suck and I wish I was somewhere else, you know, always being more or less where you want to be any time were the reason. I think it’s probably the biggest advantage of doing this, of being able to have that lifestyle design. 

Stephan Livera 01:01:33  

Yeah, I think that’s a fantastic spot to finish. I think lifestyle design makes a lot of sense. We get one life and you have to really think carefully about how you want to spend that time. And I think a lot of people are stuck in what I’m going to call home, country bias, which applies even investing world, but can also apply in terms of your life. Where do you live? How do you spend your time? So yeah, really interesting. So, I guess let let’s wrap up here. Rigel, where can people find you online and is there anything else you wanna, you know, any messages you want to put out there? 

CoinsureNZ 01:02:06  

No. Just say yeah. Usually on most of the social stuff, I’m @CoinsureNZ So, you know, yeah, feel free to hit me up on Twitter or telegram or any of those kind of spots and. And if you’ve had any questions, my DMS are open and I’m always keen to help people out with this kind of stuff and do that then, yeah, I would just, I guess closing comment. I would encourage everyone to look into this and look at like having a Plan B of some sort. As an option and just seeing about how they can dramatically increase the quality of your life, even if you’re not gonna spend a lot of time there and there’s one month, a year or one month every two years, just having that freedom, that option, I think it’s like really beneficial. For you in terms of like the set of your life, but also your mental health. So yeah, you know, get into it. Check it out. They’ll be free. 

Stephan Livera 01:02:56  

Fantastic, Thanks Rigel. 

CoinsureNZ 01:02:57  

No problems. 

Stephan Livera 01:02:58  

If you’re enjoying the show, make sure to leave a like and share it with your friends. Get the show notes at stephanlivera.com and I’ll see you in the Citadels. 

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